Даниил Андреев. «Роза Мира»
Книга I. Роза Мира и её место в истории

I. Глава 1. Роза Мира и её ближайшие задачи

Максим,
Даниил Андреев просит ничего не менять в исходном тексте.
Thanks for drawing this to my attention! I hadn't read it before. I regret not respecting his wishes. It makes total sense! Revelations must be dictated exactly as they were given or they will end up distorted. My Russian friend, Anthony, once told me, «Changing dictations is the worst thing you can do in the grand scheme of things... People are not allowed to rewrite dictations from heaven, and that they must be dictated as is directly and not changed.»
We have seen how fiercely the Old Believers clung to their tradition and refused to conform to alien reforms as the Greeks did. I was told that they were defending themselves from an attempt from the outside to change their nature and they were asserting their right to be true to themselves. On the other hand, I think they went too far in opposing Peter the Great's reform and labelling him as the Antichrist, although Peter did make the fatal mistake of trying to turn Russians into something they're not.

The iconoclast Epiphanus of Salamis was once among the enlightened, before he went out from them and betrayed them, yet he had correctly observed,
«Since there had been a change in Israel's one religion, and the scripture of the Law had been transferred to other nations, the division of Israel's opinion also resulted. And then error arose, and discord began to sow seed from the one true religion in many counterfeit beliefs, as each individual thought best, and thought that he was proficient in the letter (of scripture) and could expound it to suit himself.»
Such quote highlights the risk of exporting Roza Mira abroad. On the other hand, what grew up on Russian soil and was addressed to a Russian audience must be adapted for new hearers.

So I guess my question now is: Is it permissable to append clarifying notes and provide alternative terms (in brackets or footnotes) to Andreev's passages? For instance, when he refers to nature spirits he calls them elementals, but he also claims that they merely occupy the space in the elements for creative play. In occultism, elementals can also refer to thought-forms which Andreev refers to as egregors. Confusion ensues whenever words carry multiple meanings and they're being used differently by various authors.

Another example: the concept of Ether as a substance in the air all around us is found in every civilization, but under a different name: Prana, Chi, Akasha, Pneuma, etc. The list is colossal. We need a more scientific designation rather than sticking with provisional name of agrungvilta-prana. Andreev himself noted, «we have yet to hear what science will call it in twenty or thirty years from now».

Btw I've attached insights from a friend's spiritual experiences worked up in the astral world. Perhaps he will help corroborate Andreev's revelation. He claims to have observed regions in that world being invaded (I've also heard about this from my clairvoyant friend Kate):
«Realm invasions generally take place when a number of beings from a lower realm
band together and attempt to invade a higher realm in order to gain more Vigour from
the higher aether energy levels. It does not mean a complete takeover of the realm, and is more generally just a region or area that is invaded.»

«Occasionally an invasion is also launched by higher beings against a lower realm, however this is small in scale, generally only 1 or 2 beings, with a specific target in mind, such as one who has insulted or attacked the higher being.»
 

Вложения

Редактирование:
Jeremiah, просьба Андреева не менять его тексты вполне естественна для любого автора. Никто из публицистов и литераторов не хотел бы видеть искажение собственных мыслей.

Но это не значит, что на такие тексты, в том числе на текст «Розы Мира», нужно смотреть как на Священное Писание.

Можно и нужно проводить анализ текста, в том числе выявлять ошибки, противоречия, неточности, а также давать обширные комментарии.

Это можно делать даже на нашем форуме, где опубликованы вся проза и все стихи Д. Андреева.

Кроме того, можно и нужно делать духовный анализ, то есть смотреть, нет ли духовных подмен.

Сам Даниил предлагал таким образом анализировать даже слова Иисуса в Евангелии. Если какие-либо фразы насыщены духом грозным и беспощадным, это значит, что Христос таких слов произнести не мог, а текст Евангелия дошёл до нас с искажениями.

Поэтому тексты Андреева тоже нуждаются в анализе — научном, культурном, богословском. Надо лишь позаботиться, чтобы исходный оригинальный текст был доступен читателям в том виде, как он был написан, без искажений и адаптаций.
 
Максим,
It's common to see one's words being misreported by the press and even by people who heard it being spoken.

Rightly said, there are no infallible, unadulterated holy scriptures, they were all dictated to human writers who could make mistakes. What Andreev wrote about the error of religions dictating the
laws of hierocracies, Bertrand Russell applies to communism: «It is held as sacred and inviolable truth, to doubt which is sin and deserving of the severest punishment.»

Andreev was very far-sighted, anticipating some of the arguments/accusations his detractors might come up with. I like how he prepared ready-made answers to them, there's something similar found in Islam. Muhammed demonstrates psychological insight into the mentality of his adversaries, they are the same as then.
___

By far, the most dangerous elements to any spiritual movement are antimetaphysicians, who show an instinctive aversion and fiercely rabid reactions to any notion of transphysical ideas.
They often appear in places they don't even frequent or they have nothing better to do than frequent places where spirituality is being discussed. I suspect they are unconsciously being directed to engage with messengers. While it's sensible to approach everything with healthy skepticism, they take it to extremes by denying the very possibility of higher realities, higher worlds, the same kind of hostility seen in the reaction against Copernicus. Some of their tactics include dismissing new ideas as «delusions» (same as the Church saying «delusions of the devil»), saying they're nothing new, calling them fringe/conspiracy theories, new age/woo woo nonsense, passing over them in silence.

When I shared my findings with one of them, they dismissed it out of hand. I was told: All of these «sources» are from people just as delusional as you are. Where are the peer reviewed scientific studies? Where's the actual proof, beyond more purely anecdotal accounts?

They're especially adverse against the concept of Supreme/High Mentors.
Another one told me, «There will be no one man who will lead such a long-time, fooled crowd. It takes no single man to fix that, but it takes a lot of time and dedication.» Another one told me, «No one living on earth can build it, since with such goals no one will reach the top in fairness, even halfway, in any country in the world... There's no one who will correct the situation... It's impossible to raise such a genius in the modern world.»

Overall, their efforts are focused on hindering the spread of new ideas and discouraging people from inquiring/investigating further. The interesting part is that they don't even bother to examine its contents to discredit it. I remember one superficial reader telling me that my Tsar project was tantamount to Qanon, which portrays Trump as savior against cabals. I pressed him about whether he had actually read my document and he admitted he had only read my summary article.
 
Сам Даниил предлагал таким образом анализировать даже слова Иисуса в Евангелии. Если какие-либо фразы насыщены духом грозным и беспощадным, это значит, что Христос таких слов произнести не мог, а текст Евангелия дошёл до нас с искажениями.
Incidentally, I've been working on a compilation since last month with the goal of weeding out absurdities and falsehoods from the NT. I don't believe I'm competent/qualified enough to do this, but I'm putting it out there in the hopes that a reformer with a scientific orientation sees it. It should be noted that none of the ideas were my own, I always search for quotes by others to supplement the main idea.
For instance, «Do not resist evil» is taken to be Jesus' own words. When taken to it's logical extreme, it would mean the disappearance of civilization and culture everywhere. This verse
only makes sense as a spiritual injunction, similar to what Andreev wrote on the verse about matrinomy: he said it's «not a binding legal rule but a moral behest, that is, a spiritual warning.» Rasputin had the right idea when he recommended, «А ты оставь злое совсем в стороне, пусти его мимо...»
___

Around the turn of early 19th century, there were theologians who started examining historicity of the NT more critically. For instance, David Strauss proposed that the «miracles» were really myths and everybody revolted against him, which showed that his idea was ahead of his times. Ernst Haeckel suffered similar blows, even from those who were formal enemies of Christians: Kantians. As Andreev noted, the intelligentsia even in the heyday of Roza Mira's reign will not be fully converted.
By the early 20th century, people had come to realize that early Christianity was an uprising of the proletariat that elevated the lower caste to the top, no different from the French Revolution, which declared no intellectuals were needed. Julian's essay indicates that Galileans were mostly illiterates whose leaders had expunged their religion of everything rational, leaving only the worst traits found in Judaism and polytheism.
Serving as a stark contrast to the Alexandrian Jews, the Galileans were a mixed rabble, misled by rebels, criminal men of action, who inflamed the crowds by preaching their messianic ideals.

Once Stalin called Napoleon a lion and Hitler a kitten, because Napoleon showed a good sense to proceed with the left (until he betrayed them by crowning himself as an emperor), while Hitler thought he could handle the reactionary right (he was betrayed, of course). Khrushchev recalled how Stalin addressed his company as blind kittens, because they couldn't detect enemies in their midst without him. Basically, he was saying it's naive to appease nationalists and expect to be carried into power by them. We see something similar with Donald Trump playing to his base.

Would Jesus really have depended on fanatics to spread his message? They were the very ones who betrayed him when their hopes of receiving a messianic king were dashed. Andreev shows Judas disguised his real motive with a false one and had betrayed Christ in full awareness of His divinity! Probably Jesus came from a wealthy background, and had more in common with Philo, Clement, and Origen, who all came from the Alexandrian school. Curiously, Clement referred to Philo as the Pythagorean. Sozomen too addresses him the same way.
 

Вложения

It should also be noted that I met two women on Reddit who claimed to have met with Jesus, one saw him while awake and she has no abilities, the other one was clairvoyant and saw him while she was on the verge of death. One did not see him, she only felt his presence, while my friend Kate insisted to me that she was saved by him.
One should exercise great caution in analyzing these accounts. The demons appear to be very skilled impersonators, while many spirits in the astral world are given over to mimicry. Many guys encounter a version of Jesus during NDEs, even if they weren't religious. I came across an user on another forum, who shared with me his dream of seeing a white amphitheater, which I linked up with Andreev's white chamber Gridvutta. [edit: corrected mispelling]
 

Вложения

Редактирование:
Could these two historical sightings of pyramids/columns of Light be related to the five colored pyramids Andreev observed? Described in the context of a higher transmyth of religions.

William Whiston —
https://books.google.com/books?id=wtxbAAAAQAAJ&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false
“There seemed to be a vast Fund of lightsome vapours in the North, North-East, and North-West parts of the sky, joining to the horizon... From this Fund, which was beyond or above a Cloud, which I saw towards the West, there arose perpendicular Columns or Pyramids of Light, in several places by turns; they often changing their places and positions.”

John Pointer —
https://adsabs.harvard.edu/full/1996JHA....27..239F
“It formed several Columns or Pillars like pure flame, and afterwards darted violent flashes towards the South West, which flew with the swiftness of Lightning. At the same time there appeared several colours like Rainbows, with surprising corruscations. Sometimes they appeared sharp, and sometimes wavy...”

Two dreams worth noting:
https://old.reddit.com/r/Dreams/comments/vwtj9m/dreams_of_past_and_future_saw_the_end_of_the/ «There was a giant pyramid type building like tall as the clouds and there's a giant statue of a woman...» But the user wrongly assumed they worshipped her (Zventa-Sventana?). It's unclear if she observed a literal or transphysical pyramid.

https://old.reddit.com/r/Dreams/comments/1hq9twt/dream_about_israel_and_a_floating_tree/
«I had a dream I was in Israel and was walking up to some temple or important religious building and I mention to people around me that I can see a full, healthy, vibrant green tree rotating in the sky above the building and they tell me they don’t see it.»
 
Править Сакральные тексты — дело неблагодарное, потому что адепты веры опираются не только на Слово Логос, но и на свой мистический опыт, Слово Рема. Например, если появится заповедь, что нужно стукаться головою о дерево, то, вряд ли, кто-то будет серьёзно относиться к этому, потому что не почувствует отклика сердца, не будет понимания, что такому может наставлять Учитель, да это не будет и соответствовать общему духу Книги.

Христиане же верят не в исторического Иисуса Христа, но уже в воскресшего и вознесшегося Спасителя в славе, Который с ними уже в посланном обетованном Утешителе. А это уже во многом другой религиозный опыт, чем был у рыбаков Палестины, будущих Апостолов.

Как раз поэтому Христа и считают Богом, потому что уповают не на физического Мессию, а именно на Того, Кто сидит одесную Отца, на Логоса Шаданакара, по Даниилу Андрееву.

Да, «Роза Мира», конечно, не Священное Писание, об этом говорила А.А. Андреева, что не стоит сравнивать эти тексты, Евангелие и трактат ДА:

Роза Мира — есть явление культуры. Это Соловьев, Достоевский, Бетховен, Мусоргский, Данте и великое множество творцов и подвижников культуры. Вот ряд, в котором подобает быть «Розе Мира». Не ставьте ее с Евангелием — это нельзя. Приоритетнее Евангелие, христианство. Для России приоритетнее православие.
Потому что одно дело Миссия Христа, другое дело миссия Андреева, это несоизмеримые величины, ведь инкарнация богорожденной Монады открыла новую эру в истории Энрофа, так что даже почти вся планета отсчитывает сейчас время от Рождества Младенца Иешуа. Андреев лишь рассказал о новейшем трансфизическом опыте в художественной форме.

Но с другой стороны, религиозно-философский трактат «РМ» — это отмеченный печатью Провидения труд, во многом пророческий, новое слово во многих областях, продолжающий духовную традицию большого количества выдающихся подвижников. И, соответственно, отношения к нему несколько другое, чем просто к одному из знаковых произведений 20-го века..

**
 
Андреев лишь рассказал о новейшем трансфизическом опыте в художественной форме.
В художественной форме даны стихи и поэма в прозе «Изнанка мира» — кстати, Jeremiah, ты читал это?

«Роза Мира» — это метаисторический трактат, документальная проза с элементами поэтического стиля.
 
Редактирование:
Максим, I have begun reading it tonight. Andreev is right that the contemplation of creation must not stop at the celestial spheres, one must have also gazed into the abyss of the primordial times. This, Leonardo Da Vinci has done and described in detail, as if he were present and had lived through it himself, perhaps he sent himself back into the past?
 
Редактирование:
Николай, Sorry about the delay, I have been enjoying a break over the weekend. Yeah exactly, people develop complexes and have emotional ecstasies which validate their beliefs. Yes, it's like what Alan Watts said, they have a militant religion that puts a mythological Christ on a pedestal, they have turned him into an aberration of nature, an unnatural human. No matter how objectively Jesus' teachings were presented, how simplified the formulation was for the masses, it won't be able to reach them on their level. It has to be given in the familiar language they know or they will reject it out of hand, as do the skeptics.

Nowhere in the Bible is it taught that Christ is God (the Father, Creator). The narrative says he was making himself equal to God. The allusions to Christ being with God in the beginning and being the Son of God was about the possibility of humans evolving into co-creators/creational beings.

Thanks for sharing Andreeva's quote. The Gospels can't even be compared with real historical biographies like The Life of Apollonius, the ancient writers (i.e. Pliny) were not bereft of facts/observations and they didn't nearly as much as Christian «historians» substitute facts with their own suppositions.

подвижников seems unfitting, I would describe it as the path of the seekers. It doesn't stop at mysticism (saintliness), prophets, etc., there are also humanists, who were often found among the agnostics, such as Bertrand Russell, who wrote about how isolated and cut off from the rest of mankind he felt, «I have imagined myself in turn a Liberal, a Socialist, or a Pacifist, but I have never been any of these things, in any profound sense.»
Frederick the Great also felt this come over him, while in Breslau he wrote, «I have passed my winter like a Carthusian monk. I dine alone; I spend my life in reading and writing; and I do not sup. When one is sad, it becomes at last too burdensome to hide one's grief continually; and it is better to give way to it by oneself, than to carry one's gloom into society.»

Regarding Jesus:
While I was fleshing out the Sermon on the Mount, it became increasingly apparent that His hearers were those who felt out of place in society, they didn't feel like they belonged to any sect, they struggled more than others to adapt themselves to society's demands and find their orientation in life; above all, they felt empty inside. It was to those who feel inside that there's more to life than drudgery, amusements, worldly values (power, money), etc. that Jesus was hoping to reach, it's those who will enter into the zatomis and eventually be received into the World Synclite.
 

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